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Post by gerard on Jun 30, 2009 16:48:29 GMT 1
I'm just sitting in the library listening to some guy swearing his head off infront of wee kids and everyone else and make a complete arsehole out of himself. He may have valid reasons to be annoyed but he's not helping himself by swearing at the librarians.
Anyway, a lot of us use swearing in our work. It can sometimes be very useful in the right place, but it can also blind people to other merit's of the work.
Sometimes we get (unfairly I think) dismissed for swearing. Just wondering what does everyone else think about swearing and how it is viewed?
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Post by Marcus on Jul 1, 2009 3:12:57 GMT 1
Swearing in any art form can be eloquent and impressive (not in a fucking teenage hormonal "wow, you're so hard/cool" type of way), if done correctly. But the problem, with many things, is that it can be misused, overdone or knee-jerkingly found "offensive" by people who more than likely spend their own time vacantly wanking into a sock, the hypocrites.
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Séamus
Poet
Rhyme Junkie
Posts: 41
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Post by Séamus on Jul 2, 2009 1:43:23 GMT 1
A lot of my work does have swearing in it, but how much you swear and how often you do it and obviuously what make the difference. I recently had a music festival to do in Killinchy which I performed in front of between around 4-5 hundred people and since it was during the day many Children were attending. I did some of my older raps which are real crowd pleasers but do contain bad language but are not explicit. I was dubious about cursing but the guy organising told me to go ahead and it went well. I think the good day and atmosphere made the parents say Fuck it and the fact the pieces are funny and have a local flavour helped. Some of my work that I perform regular has a limited amount of bad language but I sometimes find myself depending on my mood and alcohol intake during readings adding fucks purely for effect. The recent slam was strange though on the train home I found myself realising that as well being able to add swear words it was not as easy to take them out of pieces I knew by heart and did regularly. As for swearing in front of kids they're going to learn it anyway in the schoolyard I think being explicit of overly abusive are much more unworthy. Marcus made a good point if I tell you to fuck off or call you a cunt what am I actually doing to you? Nothing, just words. I get offended when people try to tell me that Jesus Christ is real why should they have more say than me and am I any less human than them just because I do not believe? Hypocrites is right. I would be much more worried about the culture of anger and intolerance we live in than people who say Bastard and the fact that our system trys to say they want the kids to grow up wholesome while incouraging wars in Iraq and Afganistan and teaching young boys not to show their feelings from an early age with toy soldiers and war films! Now go fuck yourselves! Love ya's!!
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Post by clareffic on Jul 2, 2009 19:20:20 GMT 1
As a female writer I find that swearing has a number of useful consequences, it can shock an (esp male members) audience and so grab attention. It can single me out as coarse, and therefore worth listening to by some and not worth listening to by others. I do find that because I perform some poetry that contains swear words a younger audience, i.e teenagers are more likely to listen to the messages within it. However, one disadvantage i think is that people assume that all your poetry is similar. I also, as you know write some sexually implicit poems, these are hugely successful with any audience as they are conjuring the images that I don't lay out graphically, allowing the listener to step into my mind. People are ultimately nosy and deep down all of them are rude, even those who maintain their prudishness. Swearing I think, should be used to enchance the poem, elaborate on the story it tells, if it's unneccessary, take it out. As you are well aware the audience is of great importance if performing the poem, but sometimes I believe a short, sharp shock to their rude, crude and lewd button is exactly what they need, even if it's not what they fucking want!!!
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Post by colindardis on Jul 4, 2009 10:36:33 GMT 1
I get offended when people try to tell me that Jesus Christ is real why should they have more say than me and am I any less human than them just because I do not believe? Hypocrites is right. quote] How is saying that Jesus is real being hypocritical? We are all human, whether we hold any sort of faith or not; and part of being human is that we are falliable creatures, with free will. Thereofe, we have the right to choose to believe or not. I wouldn't like to think that any Christian would say they are better than anyone else just because they believe in God, but I recognise that, regrettably, there may be a few misguided people out there who try to enforce that opinion. As for swearing, I personally feel that resorting to swear words can be a little lazy at times in writing. A poet should strive to find the best, the most suitable words, and swearing can just be an easy shortcut to fall back on.
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Post by Brian Bailey on Jul 4, 2009 11:39:48 GMT 1
its f**kin dithpicable I say. now, where's the effin cursor on this effin word processor
(am too bored to finish this and make a sonnet ot couplet tho. )
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Post by silverfox on Jul 4, 2009 19:12:03 GMT 1
It's interesting how everyone has slightly different takes on the whole swearing issue. I for one agree with Colin, everyone has a freedom of choice and will. BUT. It is influenced by the actions and reactions of events laid before us all. Some people naturally will react out of anger at what they are told, and some take it on the chin. Most will enjoy a bit of debachery (espicially if it's light hearted). If it's serious enough to provoke, then expect some resistance. Espicially in reference to the whole "god squad" thing. Maybe it's ignorance, but I've stopped and been stopped many a time (and without getting on my high horse about my personal feelings) had many a debate with those people. Even the "high and mighty" ones. What I've found most astonishing is the fact that everyone bases their judgement on what they try to promote... And not the actual person him/herself. I'll keep my findings of their answers to myself for now, as a lot of new material I'm writing involves these such conversations... Ultimatly, I try to keep swearing out of my stuff, but there are times when it's useful... What other people do to influence their own works is their business... but when you have a bunch of us together giving a fantastic night like last night the credit it deserves, then it becomes a great and provocative night of poetry and thats what makes Belfast worth it weight as a poetry scene that shows absolutely no sign of dying! On a completely unrelated note. Happy 4th July
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Séamus
Poet
Rhyme Junkie
Posts: 41
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Post by Séamus on Jul 5, 2009 2:17:36 GMT 1
Nobody knows if Jesus is real it can't be proved and something that can't be conclusivly proved will always be doubted.
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Post by clareffic on Jul 5, 2009 15:32:41 GMT 1
I find it fascinating how a thread about swearing led to a religious debate. Considering that historically many swear words were religious in origin, " Jesus, Mary and Joseph", being a firm favourite of my granny! Whereas Chaucer, a little earlier used zounds (god's wounds). Bladerdash and Piffle(Alex Games) states:
the oldest sense of the verb to swear,...as the OED defines it, 'To make a solemn declaration of statement with an appeal to God or a superhuman being, or to some sacred object, in confirmation of what is said; to take an oath'. Whilst the verb to swear make have its origins in the religious many of our modern day swear words refer to the other two main categories that make it up, essentially; 'sexual language and imagery' and 'words to do with excretion '. Shitting, pissing and fucking being the order of the day, the most interesting word I found out about recently is the word berk, a fairly innoffensive swear word you'd have thought, which is derived from cockney rhyming slang Berkley hunt- cunt. From a poetry point of view, William Shakespeare used several puns and references to swear words because he was forced to by theatrical censorship. I like to think if I were to turn up to Make yourself Heard next month he would shock me with his profanity as well as his poems. Along with nearly every other highly successful playright and poet the abi;ity to shock is his or her greatest power, how they achieve that is subjective.
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Post by colindardis on Jul 6, 2009 0:09:04 GMT 1
Lots of things can't be "proved"- look at Descartes's dream argument, or any other skeptical hypotheses in philosophy (kind of like the Matrix in a way).
What is proof? It you have hurt your ankle, you feel pain. But no one can slice open your ankle and actually see the pain. They might see the cause of the pain, a twisted tendon for example, but as it is a sensory experience, it cannot be shown. The same goes for any kind of faith.
Incidentially, did you kow that 'poppycock' derives from the Dutch for 'soft shit'?
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Séamus
Poet
Rhyme Junkie
Posts: 41
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Post by Séamus on Jul 6, 2009 9:24:46 GMT 1
This debate is centuries old and will go on so you and I are not going to solve what countless other humans could'nt. You believe and I won't and we'll just leave it at that because neither of us know enough about it to win the arguement, not that it was ever even winable.
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Post by natasha on Sept 21, 2009 20:33:36 GMT 1
I don't swear as I find it vulgar. I don't really mind other people swearing occasionally, but if they use more swear words than needed in a single sentence, then they are not worth my time. I admit that sometimes swearing can be humourous when used in a certain context, but aside from that, I would walk away from someone who explicitly misuses, distorts and taints the english language that was once so beautiful.
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Post by discopirate on Oct 9, 2009 2:01:36 GMT 1
There are some things that can only be said with vulgarities. Such versatile and effective words shouldn't be discarded because society deems them 'improper'. I think it's when used in place of a vocabulary they become crass. I personally would have laughed a lot less in my life, where it not for a well-timed 'curse' by a friend or even a foe. I agree with Seamus in some ways. It's not like anyone's ever going to agree on this, it's one of those timeless debates that splits society very clearly, however, as Bob Hoskins so eloquently reminded us over and over again, "It's good to talk". Also, to quote Propaghandi, and remain pertinent, "Fuck religion."
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